Can Mek Boyz Fix Transport 8th Edition

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Ork Primer and Resources: 8th Edition Index last updated: 21 February 2018

The purpose of this thread is to provide both a basic guide of what works for new 40k Ork players in 8th, also as a resources list to assist competitive players grind to the top tables in tournaments. Please post data and I'll update the front page as nosotros become. Nosotros're stuck with our index for what is rumoured to be some other few months, so hopefully we can focus on how to play, non just what to build, and that will require heaps of customs feedback and give-and-take (I'm no expert). If you've had success with a list, especially in a tournament setting, tell us how information technology works and why it wins.

Please keep discussions relating to fluff, rules, or comparing units in a vacuum to other parts of the forums. In that location's plenty of places to argue, lets try to be constructive here boys!

General Resources:
http://bloodofkittens.com/: An updated source of successful lists for all factions.
https://www.frontlinegaming.org/tag/chapter-tactics/: A competitively focused podcast.

Mathammers:
rvd1ofakind made a massive multi-faction mathhammer spreadsheet which I truncated for the purposes of this thread, observe the attachment beneath. The full version includes chaos daemons and admec, discover information technology in his signature. Thanks rvd!
/u/HeadChime on Reddit made his own mathhammer for Orks. Y'all tin can discover some of his chapter approved comments hither and find the file fastened below, or download it here.
There'south heaps of work in these mathhammers, so send them a give thanks y'all if you observe them useful.

Articles:
How do y'all build an effective army list: General advice when constructing a tournament list
Screening 101: General communication to screen your artillery, besides useful to read from the assaulter perspective
Why Gretchin are the best Ork unit in 8th: Definitely has some acceptance to this stance, every bit gretchin showed upward in strength in the LVO.
Mob Up: Not just for Kill Point Deprival: Talks about a cute movement fox y'all can perform with our only useful stratagem.

Battle Reports and Regular army discussions:
Frontline Gaming videos on Bay Area Open 2017: The first turn of John McCools BAO 2017 Stormboy/Squiggoth list is here.
Bells of Lost Souls interview with Val Heffelfinger: A Full Warzone Atlanta 2017 pause down and list discussion with Val Heffelfinger's Big Trakk/Squiggoth listing
Frontline Gaming Chapter Tactics podcast on the LVO: Val Heffelfinger guests in this podcast discussing the LVO 2018. He talks about his new list and tournament experience at the offset.
Warhammer Telly on twitch broadcasted the GT oestrus 3 and showed Orks first circular. You lot'll need to exist subscribed to watch.

Tier list of units:
Taken from our other thread discussion, thanks to pismakron, koooaei, and Jidmah. Some changes take been made from that list, they are highlighted in scarlet and take not been heavily discussed.

Spoiler:

Unanimously considered excellent choices, you can not bring as well many of these things:

Boyz I of the best units in the game. The math favours sluggas, merely shootas works surprisingly well and gives y'all some flexibility. If you are struggling with orks, bring more than boyz.
Ghazkgull An absolute killing auto and surprisingly durable. Works well in mechanized lists as well as with foot infantry.
Weirdboy An car-include. The weirdboy tin can reliable deny whatsoever psyker, is a smite machine, and has access to two good powers in Warpath and Da Jump.
Stormboyz Good for bracketing vehicles so they cannot autumn back. Also, you lot don't lose out on the Greentide bonus past taking lots of min-sized squads. Basically faster moving boyz for a decent cost.
Kommandos They can appear anywhere any fourth dimension y'all similar. While their bonus to their cover salve is rarely useful, they are 15 boyz that can appear correct next to your opponent, and boyz are good. They can get 2 burnaz for free.
Kustom Mega-Kannon Since price drop in CA, they are our best shooting option. Y'all can take 1 crew burn down multiple guns and have they other crews capture objectives and/or chimera-wrap.
Gargantuan Squiggoth There'southward no denying that when this guy hits the table orks hitting the elevation tables, throw some burnas or tankbustas on his back and they'll rain hell for at least a turn or two. Likely our best transport selection.

Corking support staff, only non the core of your army:

Warboss The buffs provided by a warboss are crucial for boy blobs, and his damage output is quite decent. The 'eadwomper'southward killchoppa (relic BC) is the best selection for a Warboss, equally is a Warbike, but leave the Mega Armor at home.
Zhadsnark Competes with your warboss on a bicycle slot, merely has the speed to proceed upwards with stormboyz and pressure a flank really well.
Big Mek An of import office of most ork lists, merely non an auto-include. Always give him a KFF. A Warbike is as well a proficient option as the KFF is very dependent on positioning. Don't waste points on klaws, saws, blastas or the shokk assail gun.
Painboy The 6+ relieve is pretty weak, but his abillity to heal characters is very useful. Healing weirdboyz and Ghaz will earn his points back, and with iv attacks he has ameliorate damage output than a Large Mek.
Mad Dok Grotsnik A better painboy but more expensive. He is pretty tough with dual FNP saves and as killy as a warboss.
Tankbustas Very decent damage output, but they are way too squishy to use on foot. Works well in mechanized lists. Only unit of measurement that can make good utilize of the DakkaDakkaDakka stratagem.
Imprint Nob Provides a nice vitrify for all Ork lists, simply he is pretty expensive. He is good with both walkers and footsloggers.
Gretchin The cheapest fashion to fill the board and sit down on objectives, they will foreclose deep strikes and tin can shoot at a pretty expert hit rate (sometimes even 3+!). They seem to be on the rise in ITC lists as of Feb'18.
Dakkajet It tin practice plenty of impairment, and is the but thing in our army that has -1 to hit. It's as well ok at killing annihilation, but not actually good against any specific targets. Tin exist useful for assassinating characters, as information technology can jump next to them and unload its guns on them.
Trukk At present half a battlewagon for half the toll. Our best transport selection that'southward not a Gargantuan Squiggoth.
Big Trakk The flamers on these things are outrageous

Some utilize cases, merely more often than not less efficient than the above options:

Nobz Come stock with 4+ armor now and can take ammo runts that increment their durability - especially useful confronting multi-wound weapons. They are an important office of nigh mechanized lists, but sadly our vehicles are overpriced. All shooting options but shootas are too expensive.
Kannon Non equally good every bit the KMK since it has only one shot and big guns are less tough than mek guns. However a decent anti-tank weapon, especially when spammed.
Snikrot Crawly objective camper due to his cover buff. If you accept 2+ units of kommandoz, he can support them, but is by no means required to do and then.
Gorkanaut Very tough and a animal in close-combat. The shooting is kind of meh, but better than the morkanaut.
Morkanaut Similar the Gorkanaut but with less harm output and a gun that fries itself. Received a price drop in CA and might be considered worth bringing sometimes.
Zaggstruk Extremely good if you have multiple total-sized squads of stormboyz. Some people take reported success running him on his ain.
Runtherd Gaining some usefulness purely due to the potential gretchin have been showing, probably an auto-include if you lot're bringing twoscore+ gretchin.
Battlewagon Ok with difficult-superlative and a deff-rolla. They are expensive and nearly shooting options are non worth it for their points. Best ship for melee units with fiddling shooting, but also expensive and too easy to kill by defended anti-tank.

Bring these in your fluffly lists, but otherwise shelf them:

Kaptin Badrukk he is a strong shooting unit of measurement with mediocre range, however his aura doesn't work well with flash gits at all for multiple reasons. Therefore most useful without flash gits.
Burna Bommer Bombs work best against aristocracy infantry, has one more than big shoota than a blitza bommer. Use Explosive Demise to discourage your opponent from shooting it downwardly or do lots of harm. Use CP to re-roll explosion effect. Practice not have skorcha missiles.
Skorchas very cheap and good weapons, merely their outflanking is almost useless because skorachs are always out of range. Deploy them regularly, and so they can skorch something after advancing beginning plow.
Killa Kan Reasonably durable and shooty, simply needs lots of baby sitting: A Banner Nob to make them usefull in close combat and a Bik Mek with a KFF to make them survive. They also need a warboss or command-points to aid with morale. Oh, and they don't benefit from 'Ere We Go.
Lootas Good damage output, but very squishy and needs to remain stationary. Use command points to re-coil their shots.
Warbikers really fast, have good shooting, are quite durable vs small artillery burn but fold like moisture newspaper vs impairment 2 or more weapons - most notably overcharged plasma. Since they get to strike first when charging their melee is at present decent.

Don't bring these if you're trying to win:

Warbuggies/trakks they are basically a couple bikers welded together resulting in a slight increment in durability. Rokkits make them too expensive, big shootas aren't really great weapons. Can outflank.
Deffkopta The bomb is skilful, and the ability to assail things that are behind a screen tin can be game-winning and they announced almost anywhere on the board. On the downside they are expensive and squishy and do likewise little.
Chimera chukka Fun option that has the potential to be totally devastating or totally harmless. Most important value is number of shots, and then strength. Strength doesn't matter if you fail to hit, AP and impairment don't thing if you fail to wound.
Zzap gun More than unreliable version of the kannon, but could potentially do 3 mortal wounds and kill three marines or something. Not worth the actress iii points over a kannon though, and KMK does it improve.
Blitza-Bommer Bombs are proficient at causing mortal wounds, perfect for squads of infantry but not that good against vehicles. Since CA more expensive than burna bommer without really being better at anything relevant.
MANz Kill likewise niggling due to hitting modifier, likewise slow. They are difficult to impale roadblocks, but not worth their points. Dual killsaws are superior to shooting options.
Deff dread Very good damage output, merely the dread is very squishy and badly needs KFF protection. Too slow to reliably charge on turn two. They are useless for shooting.
Burnas Too expensive and to squishy. Both shooting and melee is inferior to regular boyz.
Wazbom Blastajet Instead of paying for a KFF that'southward never where you demand information technology and a airplane with guns that don't hit the broad side of a befouled, bring another bommer.
Nob Bikers twice the cost of a nob with ammo runt with little to testify for it. Combined with all shooting options bein expensive as sin, not worth fielding.
Lobba Don't pay 26 points for a big shoota.
Smasha gun In that location is no reason to not get a KMK instead of this. Withal better confronting fliers than tractor kannons.
Tractor kannon Strictly worse than regular kannon, even against flyers.
Mini mek He has a cool model, but he really has no purpose. Waste of points.
Wink Gitz Very expensive and very squishy. They badly need a transport but they also need to remain stationary.
Stompa Costs three times they points of a grokanaut with the shooting of one.

Orks place in the meta:

Spoiler:

(as of February 2018)

The general consensus on these forums is that Orks are a Low to MID tier army. People will frequently say we are ane of the all-time "index" armies (probably 2d, backside sisters). Importantly: anyone with a codex will typically have a natural advantage over you (except maybe grey knights). Consider the broader context when building your listing. If you are playing against an army that is considered summit tier (such as Imperial Soup) you should bring your A game, fifty-fifty if they country they are bringing a fluffy list.

In a tournament setting, when extremely powerful single units are dominating the meta, such as Bobby One thousand or the brothers Mag and Morty, Orks horde style volition increase in value. Alpha strike armies will take the stage and are aimed at killing these monsters in one turn. And then, bringing a large book of inexpensive units has the chance to counter this strategy. Still, when you see other horde armies dominating the meta, for example the end of 2017 where induct spam was a huge deal, our greenish-tide list drops in value. During those months, Gargantuan Squiggoth lists were doing very well equally that unit of measurement alone was a nightmare to destroy with guns that were aimed to kill T3 units. If you're going to bring Orks, your army is non strong enough to disregard/ascertain the meta, y'all should bring a list that counters the current hot-stuff-list.

Here'south a recent meta breakup of the LVO 2018. The data shown corresponds closely to the consensus on these forums (at to the lowest degree for orks).

There are some themes in what people are bringing to recent ITC tournaments:
/u/JelloJay on Reddit comments about Orks in the LVO 2018

"Quite a few ork players went four-2.
Everyone has KFF large meks, weirdboys, and most have painboys. Later that, information technology'southward a smattering of stormboys, kommandos, KMKs, dakkajets, and large trakks:
Jacob Ballard, four-one-one 120 boys 36 stormboys nearly 90 grots thirty kommandos
Michael Grove, 4-ii ninety boys 9 kommandos xv kommandos 5 kmks double dakkajets three weirdboys, ghazzy
Charles Craig, 4-ii 90 grots 60 stormboys (25, 25, 10) dakkajet 4 weirdboys
Rich Kilton, 4-two (#1 ork) boy spam, stormboys, 6 weirdboys
Val Heffelfinger 4-2 (#2 ork) 60 boys, 38 stormboys, aquila strongpoint, kommandos
Ben Jurek 4-2 (a new player to kicking) 90 boys weirdboys garg squig dakkajet 6 kmks large trakk kommandos
Geoffrey Beaman, 3-2-1 ghazzy fifty boys 26 grots 4 weirdboys 2 large trakks 50 stormboys 2 large trakks 5 KMKS
Bricklayer Moore 3-3. Chinorks with Flash gitz! sixty boys, tons of grots, weirdboys"

More recently, two Ork players performed very well in the 40k GT Heat 3. One list was reported to take brought green tide + mek back up. Much of the word around this unexpected consequence included the mission types being favourable for hordes, as we can control multiple objectives for a substantially long time before we are tabled. This tournament ran Chapter Approved missions.

WAAAA AAAA AAAA AAAAA AAAAAA AAAAAA AAAAAAAGH Beneath are some examples of archetypes of Ork lists that are cropping up.
They are by no means prescriptive, they are only ideas of what has worked in the past and might work for you.
Brand your own list and relish the hobby your ain way. _____________ Pure Green Tide

This is currently the DakkaDakkaDakka consensus of the best list Orks currently accept. When the new Ork role player arrives on these forums and asks "what should I bring?" the answer is "bring more than boyz", and the answer is non wrong. Pure green-tide brings our most efficient units and tin sometimes completely counter a meta of high ap loftier harm weapons.

Spoiler:

Cadre units

Boyz/Stormboyz/Kommandos: The more than the merrier, no wrong answers between these three units. The current trend is to bring BC instead of PK, but there is likely no incorrect answer with your Dominate Nob melee weapon choice. Don't upgrade your range weapons.
Weirdboyz: Your essential heavy back up unit. Supercharge your smites with 100+ bodies, and jump boyz all over the table. A versatile psyker and critical source of mortal wounds.
Gretchin: The backfield unsung heroes. Agree objectives and even shoot someone through the optics every now and then. An essential office of preventing deep strikes in your deployment zone.

Instance Lists

Jacob Ballard'southward LVO 2018 (53rd): 120 boyz, 2 warbosses, 36 stormboyz, a painboy, ii weirdboyz, snikrot, runtherd, and 84 gretchin.

Charles Craig's LVO 2018 (71st): xxx boyz, 90 gretchin (30, 30, 30), one warboss on bike, threescore stormboys (25, 25, 10), a painboy on bike, 4 weirdboyz, Zagstruk, dakkajet, trukk, runtherd, big mek (KFF), big mek on cycle (KFF)

Rich Kilton's LVO 2018 (117th): 98 boyz (30, 29, 29, ten) , 1 warboss, 41 stormboyz (19, 17, 5), 2 painboys, 6 weirdboyz, snikrot, nob due west/ imprint, battlewagon w/ 'ard instance and deff rolla.

Why it wins

This army overloads the opposing armies firepower. You hope to see a tonne of las cannons and smite spam on the other side of the table. All their mortal wounds and expensive guns volition have to hit a six point Boy, and you're happy about that. Information technology can take some armies a full plow to delete a 30man squad of boyz, and yous brought 5! You'll be able to sit down on objectives forever, mucilage up the board, and generally own the spaces you desire to own. Progressive point based missions such as ITC are excellent for this list as you can proceeds points every turn with objectives. However, you don't often take the punch to impale the enemy, and then you lot'll demand keen ability to utilize the terrain to mitigate the damage you take, or land some clever charges to turn off their firepower. If you run into a flank that is out of position, get a Da Jump off and beginning overwhelming information technology with Boyz (ideally with Stormboy or Kommando support). If you can completely surround a heavy unit of measurement, you not only prevent information technology from falling back, just you besides protect the entire boy team from being shot at (large bargain!).

What non to practise

Sometimes (rarely) information technology's non the correct answer to accuse forrad. Play the objectives, don't throw your army away. Charging forrard volition mean that their entire army can shoot at full strength, merely if you hide and out-range some weapons y'all'll survive for longer and likely earn more than points. Turn i Da Jump xxx Boyz can experience really tempting, simply sometimes you're just sending them off to die, they only have a 50% gamble to stick that charge after they jump. If yous accept enclosed buildings to hide inside, or big blocks of terrain to abuse, you should exist working with those elements instead of sacrificing Boyz in the promise to "turn off their gunline". If y'all think you lot can make your enemy move forwards considering you are able to hide, then don't run at them and wait for them to come to you.

Go along in mind, there are already discussions all over the competitive scene regarding what to do about "slow-play", since many armies are non completing their prescribed turns. Sometimes it tin be as bad equally turn 3 average. Oddly plenty, I would say this benefits green-tide, but make sure you accept the power to move 200+ bodies at a reasonable speed and so that yous are not slapped with tiresome-play warnings. This can be a difficult army to stop a game in under 3 hours.

_____________________ Green Tide + Mek Support

This type of listing has been pretty consistently showing up every bit our best performer in a diversity of tournaments. It has a good residuum of heavy and light armour, heavy and light shooting, and leans into our nearly efficient units.

Spoiler:

Cadre units

Boyz/Stormboyz: Still an essential part to the army, merely you'll more likely bring effectually 90 bodies instead of the 150+ in pure green tide. Yous may also bring less back up staff; Ghazkul and warbanners will be less common in these lists. Your Stormboyz volition act every bit a counter charge crew in some cases, or a desperate first turn charge in other cases. Don't throw them abroad though, they get you ITC mission points (recon) and impale characters better than anything in your army. Effort to get total surrounds on units and keep the boys in combat.
Kustom Mega Kannons: This unit of measurement changes your backfield substantially, and is the uncontested nigh efficient shooter nosotros have in the index. Exist smart with your Grot crews, only i is needed to shoot the guns, the residual tin can abuse their "Take-Embrace" rule and hide all over the lath. You'll almost certainly be supporting these guns with a KFF.
a single Trukk or a Dakkajet: These units are seen in most lists of this nature. The Trukk helps drops, and protects your Tankbustas, and the Dakkajet distracts shots away from yous KMKs. Both are inefficient in points, so don't bring too many, but they serve a vital role now that you have other heavy armoured units in your regular army that are priority targets (KMKs).

Example Lists

Jeff Everitt'southward Attack-X 2017 (1st)

Elliott Levy's Rampager GT 2017 (2nd)

Ben Mohile's NOVA Open up 2017 (top 12): Zhadsnark, Large Mek on bicycle (KFF), 100 Boyz (30, 30, 30, 10), Trukk, 2 Big Trakk, 5 KMK, 4 Weirdboy, one Painboy, x Tank bustas (5, v).

Morgan Cole'south GT Heat three 2018 (2nd)

Why it wins

You go the advantages of pure green tide when trying to overload your opponents weapons, merely besides have the firepower to put pressure their army. You'll likely lose an all out shooting state of war, but in that location are some armies that will have to come to you, which is great news for Boyz. The KMK line is surprisingly resilient, and the Grots are extremely effective bubble wraps for things like Magnus. You'll not find an regular army that can pressure your back line too as you tin can pressure their back line, and then effort to meet people mid-field if they come running, or Leap to a weak flank after they charge out and shell their backline (while they accept their sweet fourth dimension getting through KMKs and impaired 5 homo squads of grots). You may have the luxury to play to your strengths if the terrain allows it (i.e. shoot at em if they tin can't handle your KMKs, or control the board and slowly die while taking objectives).

What not to do

Don't act similar an imperial guard gun-line and pretend KMKs will get you there (chimera-wrap and castle). Equally opposed to pure-green-tide (where charging forrard can only cause you to lose more than units for no reason), when you lot shut downward an opponents gun-line with this army, you have at present bought more turns for your KMKs to shoot. Never return to protect your gun line, allow the 250 points of KMKs y'all brought die to Mortarion (or those turn ane charging genestealers) and get your boyz in the field taking up space/objectives. Never lose sight of the objectives, and don't be precious nigh losing your heavy units (they weren't winning y'all the game anyhow, boyz are).

______________________ The Gargantuan Squiggoth

This unit of measurement changes the dynamic of your listing, and was running around in our top lists for most of tardily 2017. It changes the style you evaluate tankbustas, burnas, and kommandos. The ITC meta might accept shifted abroad from bringing this animate being, only it yet warrants commentary.

Spoiler:

Core units

The Gargantuan Squiggoth: Sit some Tankbustas on his back, or some Burnas, or some Kommandos with free burnas, wow even some Flash Gitz! (don't bring Wink Gitz). Expect heavy fire to land on this Squiggoth, so bring heavy vehicles to support him as they will have a bit of a free time until the giant dies. Big Trakks or KMKs feel similar a good fit here.

Instance Lists

Michael Fox's BAO 2017 (11th)

John McCool'due south BAO 2017 (24th)

Adrian Phillips' BAO 2017(38th)

Val Heffelfinger'due south Warzone Atlanta 2017 (2nd)

Why it wins

When people are not ready to abolish 30-some wounds of a dinosaur. Information technology'due south roughshod on the charge, so obviously that is essential gameplay. You ride it into battle and flame everything that'southward near information technology and not in combat (riders tin still shoot when the squig is in combat). Information technology looks mean and dangerous, and manifestly a smashing distraction for a flank of Big Trakks and the like.

What not to do

Bring him when everyone is out to kill magnus and morty. Unfortunately I'g not familiar enough with this list to know the gameplay pitfalls.

__________ Mechanised

Everyone in the forums wants to bring their heavy armour toys, then I'm including this as general communication only. This stuff here is strictly fluffly . None of this information has shown proven effectiveness in a tournament army, and so it's actually just speculation. I suppose the reason yous would do this is to bring but heavy armoured units to bolster the durability of boyz or to negate the effectiveness of zero AP weapons. Or perhaps you want to get your games washed really reallllllly quickly.

Spoiler:

Probable the best performing units

Trukks (with tankbustas), Dakkajets/Burna Bombas, Large Trakks, Killtanks, and Mek Gunz. This is only a mix of things that have reasonable durability and some firepower on them. Yous rarely (if ever) desire to add whatsoever weapons on a vehicle that has BS 5+, and so avoid that at all costs. Bring more vehicles and fill them up with green boyz instead.

Things that take potential

Morkanauts, Battlewagons (westward/ deffrollas and killkannons), and Warbikers/Nobz on bikes. Battlewagons pop up every now and and so, T8 is no joke but you can't shoot out of it at that bespeak. Bikers take been on some peoples radars but like every other army, there are besides many two and 3 harm weapons out in that location for bikers with a mere 4+ save to not become deleted.

Things that look tempting, but yous should avoid:

Killa Kans, Deff Dreads, Stompas, Flash Gitz, and Mega Nobz. Don't practice information technology. Only don't. Bring em if yous want to win a painting contest and like to have huuuuge breaks between rounds.

Instance Lists

nah

How the list works

Information technology waits for our codex.

Delight help me build this into something useful. You tin can about consider the headings placeholders, I actually didn't know what to put here that would be useful for everyone (I only know what I would similar). If you eat some resources that others should know about, lets hear about it. If you think I've missed anything crucial, or would similar to have a heading added whatever, lets make information technology happen. i dont know why i signed up for this please assistance

Very nice consolidation of info.

Very cool thread

Dandy job I beloved the fading WAAAAGH office.

Hey mate, corking get-go here! A couple of opinions though - starting time, isn't the Dakkajet one of our nigh points effective units? It's BS4 (if all the guns point at the same target), with lots of dakka, and fast. As yous pointed out, information technology is amazing at character assassination.

The second unit is one that i call back you've criminally underrated: Rokkit Buggies. The Chapter Approved points drop really saved them, so that yous can now take iii for the cost of 2 - like anything Orky, they're best in greater numbers. Six Rokkits (iii Warbuggies) works to an average of two hits, at S8 AP-2 3D. Very useful. Which leads into a third affair, a hybrid list ive been having a lot of success with:

Da Blastoff Strike! It will basically piece of work as a supplement to other lists - I run two or 3 mobs of Kommandos, with Warbuggies every bit fire support. For around 300 points you can accept iii min Kommando mobs and three Rokkit buggies in identify to back up your Da Spring mob.

Something else that I've been having some success with is Jumping small Tankbusta mobs against lists like IG parking lots - you can throw away 100 points to cripple Basilisks and the like, and when theyre combined with Rokkit Buggies you can do real impairment. I've managed to apply flop Squigs every bit grapheme hunters recently too; there's often room in T1 or T2 to drop in a 7 model unit of measurement where a 30 Boy mob wouldn't fit, and 2 Squigs hitting on 2s can ruin a graphic symbol's 24-hour interval (got Cawl with some on Monday evening).

Thank you for the comments. I'1000 really interested in your success with the buggies (have yous used skorchas?), that is something that no 1 is talking about on these forums. Tin you lot give an example list? Maybe some strengths and weaknesses? I really like your use-case of mini-alpha-strike-support with a jump, I've never tried something like that. Take you considered Chinorks for this strategy? I think buggies have been largely disregarded because of their BS5+, and if they are not shooting they are doing nix else that exciting.

And as for the dakkajet, I'm open up to information technology being top teir, personally it's my favourite unit to bring in ITC. Only I think I'm a lilliputian biased since dakkajets are only recently gaining steam in their success. Perhaps the only limiting factor is that you can not spam them, realistically it is as well expensive and inefficient to bring more than... 3? For me that makes the dakkajet non as good as a male child, or a weirdboy, etc. But I would argue the dakkajet is an essential component to bring as a one-of in every ITC listing.

I have used Skorchas, but they're a bit rubbish to Outflank with - that 8" range. They exercise stone when sitting behind some screening units to target Tau Stealthsuits and the similar though.

Buggies are a bit of a surprise parcel: every bit well as having Outflank they have a 4+, 5W, T5, and 4 Attacks in assault. Obviously the negative is their BS5, but when you lot take three puff them you should average 2 S8 AP-2 hits. I know some Redditors who run six, but I usually just take 3 - although vi are only 350 points, so above about 1k that should be more viable.

Basically, I combo them with three min Kommandos mobs - two Burnas in each, if I'chiliad feeling saucy I'll give the Nobz Large Choppas. This means that you end upwardly with half-dozen Rokkit shots from the Buggies and nine Slugga shots; and in the Assault phase you lot become six AP-2 attacks from the Burnas, ix whatever y'all've put on your Kommando Nobz, twenty-7 from your Kommandos, and twelve from your Buggies. Four different charges, which ways that statistically two should go far. This is earlier we even account for what you've Da Jumped.

I similar the wait of Chinorks, and am planning a kitbash of one from some spare Koptas I've got lying around - 80 points is a steal. Sucks that the guns are heavy, simply I reckon putting some Nobz in there with ammo runts to take the inevitable crash wounds would exist a lethal add-on to my Alpha Strike.

ChrisWhite wrote:
criminally underrated: Rokkit Buggies

Information technology's hard to underrate a primarily shooty unit that you need to invest ~ 650 points into to kill a single rhino.

I've fielded both buggies and skorchas and while they might exist fun for a casual game where you don't really want to win, they're likewise inefficient for annihilation else. Not durable enough for points to be a disruptor, too depression damage output to kill anything significant. Tin can probbly be used to agree dorsum till the anti-tank is downwardly to grab points later in the game. And then, this might work in casual. They're fun to convert of grade.

Single buggies worked for me like min squad of kommandos, they both don't practice much impairment simply they may exist useful during the game. I adopt skorchas since we have more efficient range anti tank than rocket buggies, merely they're besides ok. Of form you lot need lots of armored stuff to make them worthy like mek gunz, planes, trukks, BWs, kanz...

I find that you don't necessarily accept to impale the unit you're shooting at - dropping something similar Basilisks, Wyverns, Preds, or Razorbacks downwards a tier should exist plenty to give your oncoming army some survivability. I find that, when combined with Kommandos and your Da Bound, information technology's enough of a lark to buy more of your enemy's shooting, meaning even more survivability for everyone else.

650 points of Buggies is what, 10 Buggies? That'southward 20 shots, vii hits at AP-2. 21 Wounds inflicted, slightky less, depending on saves. You should kill 2 Rhinos with that.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
And I'm not a huge fan of Skorchas, given that y'all can't shoot anything on the plough you come up in!

Since skorchas are assault weapons, you are improve off deploying them on the field and advancing them towards something valuable. If you deploy them on a flank they can reach nearly of that table half plough 1.

IMO the outrider deployment is a trap.

ChrisWhite wrote:

650 points of Buggies is what, 10 Buggies? That'south 20 shots, 7 hits at AP-2. 21 Wounds inflicted, slightky less, depending on saves. Yous should kill 2 Rhinos with that.

1 buggy costs 57 pts, it has 2 rokkit shots, 0.67 of which hit, 0.4 of which wound, 0.296 of which get through armor and cause 3 wounds resulting in 0.89 damage per buggy. Divide x rhinoceros wounds by 0.89 and y'all end up with 11.25 buggies. That's 641.25 pts of rokkit buggies.

Well, technically, since you can only bargain three wounds at a time, you demand to downward 12 instead of ten. Means you need to bargain four unsaved wounds to a rhino. That's 770 pts of rokkit buggies. In comparing, you need 810 pts of shootaboyz that will ONLY shoot to kill a rhinoceros. That'due south how bad rokkit buggies are at really killing annihilation.

we ran buggies at adepticon for the squad tournament, strictly to fit our theme. I own a ton and really hadn't used them in eighth yet. They performed lackluster at all-time, especially compared to the tankbustas in trukks.

I dear the idea of them but they need something to help. Peradventure three shots? Mayhap 2d3 shots that do 2 damage? They demand something for certain.

A proficient thread that could do with a piffling updating since the last FAQ

The Chinork is definitely worth mentioning. Cost of a trukk that tin can deepstrike and is now open topped!

grendel083 wrote:
A good thread that could do with a picayune updating since the terminal FAQ

The Chinork is definitely worth mentioning. Price of a trukk that can deepstrike and is at present open topped!

It's the real earth cost of the Chinork that is prohibitive. Being in Canada ways that I could buy 5 trukks for the cost of 1 Chinork (75 pounds plus delivery works out to $150 after substitution). The Chinork won't last long enough on the table to justify that.

grendel083 wrote:
A good thread that could do with a little updating since the terminal FAQ

The Chinork is definitely worth mentioning. Price of a trukk that tin can deepstrike and is now open topped!

Currently none of the FW units are mentioned because no 1 bothered to make a list. Feel free to create 1, and I will add it to the first page.

Outside of that, I think we should await for the codex before updating annihilation. Peculiarly kommandoz have fallen a lot in value, for example.

I'm posting this hither in this thread as well every bit the main thread because information technology tin can become a bit bogged downward over there.

Spoiler:

Hither'south how I'd play em, and some mandatory CP spending.
List 1:
This is a standard area denial listing. You backfield will be all grots and 1x30 boyz and 1x10 boyz. deploy KMK as far forrad every bit possible. Spend 2 CP to deepstrike 1x30 boyz. Turn 1 you are using warbikes dakka guns and stormboyz and even your KMK to clear infinite and kill screens for your beta strike plough 2.
Turn two y'all Mob up your backfield boyz (40man) and da spring with your deepstrike. That'due south 70 boyz, they all have to be evil sunz for the 8" charge. KMKs are all-time blue, as nosotros've discussed, and your big mek sticks effectually back there. I'd load up the wartrike with the relic klaw and the evil suns warlord trait that allows autumn back shoot and charge. Nothing footing breaking in this listing, but I think its very good. Suffers from not enough -AP. I like this list because the warbikes are the only targets for billowing smoke, and it actually helps them stick around, i'm thinking a 10man warbike team is pretty comparable to 30 shootas, in damage and toll.

Listing 2:
Really not sure how this listing goes, but they all fit in battlewagons, pretty cheap now those cars. You got some 1x10 boyz for objectives at the back, they need to exist the blood axe ones then yous can get at least a v+. The vehicles beingness blood axe is besides pretty solid. Still jumping a 1x30 boyz hither, but the 2x19 are in wagons and the flashgitz might exercise some work too, who knows. I'm not sold on this list, only it'due south something.

List 3:
I'm pretty sure this is the simply way to play Kans. The deep strike stratagem allows 20PL or less, and currently deff dreads are 21 PL for three in a unit of measurement. And then if that drops down below xx, then this idea is fething fire. No big shootas on your deff dreads, you but spend iv CP and launch 6x4 kan klaws at your enemy, they have to exist evil sunz for the charge. It's actually super affordable. The residue of this list leans on some battle wagons doing the ramming speed stratagem and hurting things with deff rollas, they were good earlier merely way ameliorate now with the price. Yous want as many speedy HQ as possible in this list beacuse your deff dreads will protect them very well past being closer. Go along in mind, in one case the deff dreds land you lot're GUARANTEED to get a charge off since you're making 6 unlike 8" rerollable charges, theres no fashion they'll all fail. All-time affair about this listing as they actually have zippo to shoot simply t7+ targets for turn one. Possibly get a 'ard top for the ghazkul battlewagon.
This list tin't impale flyers, and once it lands, information technology'south actually deadening, probably gets slammed by eldar/harlequins.
I'm spending a lot of CP on relics in this list, if wartrikes can pick them upwardly i'll be bringing the new klaw, headwoppa, and making one of them cybork body 5+++.

List four:
Snakebite Goff babeeeeee, i'yard leaning into Monster Hunter stratagem here (+1 to West vs a target). I'd be skarboyzing 2x30 boy squads hither, deep strike i, and da leap the other, crash that gak turn 2. The non skarboy 1x30 can trudge up the board with ghaz, proceed him prophylactic. Y'all clear a path with your dakka jets (dont forget brand one of them -2 to hit with billowing smoke stratagem) and then land your dick dial goff male child team turn 2 and warpath one of them.

Turn 1, you da leap the tankbustas, pop monster hunter, and shoot all your KMK, squiggs, and rokkits at whatever you desire, magnus, morty, castellans, shadowblades, whatsoever. get it done. The tankbustas will die, but what I similar about this list as that all the things on the tabular array worth shooting volition take 6+++, and the dakkajets will be -1 and -2 to striking. I think this list has legs.

Warboss has the headwoppa relic here. Warlord trait will be +1atk and +1str, give ghaz a run for his money.

Listing five:
I tried to brand the all-time gunline I could think of without bringing 18 KMK (which is probably still right btw). Of the new vehicles, the scrapjet with the +1 to hit vehicles is probably the only one worth bringing, and information technology has a specific anti-tank role in this listing that the list would otherwise suffer a chip from. I recollect 1x30 boyz mobbed up with 1x10, da jumped, and shoot twice with the bad moonz stratagem is going to be NASTY, and may well fit into every list. Once you delete their screens with 160 shots (not including DDD on 5'southward with the stratagem), y'all'll drop down the deep striking nobz to clean up the heavy armor. In this list im spending 6CP to deep strike all iii of my elite squads. The only thing that bothers me is that they are not evil sunz (they probably should be), but I think specifically in this list you want nobz to be goffs because the exploding 6'southward really benefit these heavy hitters. You're hoping these nobz country and do serious damage, beacuse they are Expressionless after they've finished. But fighting later they die should exist crawly (stratagem). I would consider a wartrike in here instead of the big mek on cycle perhaps, if you lot wanted to adv and charge the scrapjets.
I know this is going to sound weird, only im bringing the +1 psych power relic with this list. you Demand that spell to get off. Merely the thunderbluss wouldnt be the worst either.

List 6:
Claret axes are how yous make a proficient and solid area deprival brigade. Imagine the lootahs, they are in trukks in this listing, every bit nosotros used to do it. But, with the looted tank stratagem, once the trukk dies, these guys are iv+ wherever they stand, and hopefuly they become a bespeak drib. If you're using max range with these blokes that'll make them pretty hard to kill, and so long as you have taken up enough space to stop the flyers getting in your deployment zone. Otherwise im only min maxing the residue of the regular army hither, I still want the shoota mob up/da jump here from list five to clear out screens (only its no where equally good equally bad moonz version), but at that place are heaps of durable notes here. ten warbikes will love billowing fume -1, the boomdakka has that built in, the ii painboyz volition go a long manner hither, and you've got a stationary and mobile big mek KFF.

This is the only listing i would consider 'ard male child stratagem, and i would put information technology on all 3 of my boy squads for 6CP, worth.
Only for flavors sake, i would give my big mek on bike the finkin hat. Load him up with +one atk +1str +1dmg and rerolls, then give him headwoppa.

P.Southward there are heaps of point errors and spelling errors or any in this mail, but you get the idea. I did this compilation mostly from memory and mostly for myself merely thought i'd share some ideas. Any point value in a box is me speculating... e.1000. i think lootas volition driblet a couple of points, and KMK might go back to their original indicate value before CA.

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